A dialogue with Boris Koprivnikar, CEO Sincular Consulting. Former deputy Prime Minister Republic of Slovenia. This dialogue covers how to build services and systems – such as multi-cloud federated egov systems – that are not only build for short-termism, but for something that will last? Why are coordination, co-creation, transparency, trustworthiness, technological-neutrality and having an accountability life cycle approach essential catalysts and success factors? How to operationalise European values summarised in the triangle of intertwined horizontals of (1) more green, (2) more digital and (3) more resilient? While everything is interconnected, meanwhile, our societies including national governments are organised vertical. It that one of the reasons why we are not able to address the many urgent societal challenges in an accountable way? What kind of data strategy and leadership do we need?